Testimony concludes in accused shooter's fitness hearing

All evidence has been presented to a jury of 12 people tasked with deciding if Matthew Vincent Raymond is fit to stand trial on four murder charges.

On Thursday afternoon, forensic psychiatrist Dr. Scott Woodsidewas the second and last person to take the stand in Fredericton.

He followedAlex Pate, an articling student who works with Raymond's lawyer, Nathan Gorham.

The testimony of both men is under a publication ban imposed by Justice Fred Ferguson of the Court of Queen's Bench.

Raymond, 49, is charged in the shooting deaths of constables Sara Burns and Robb Costello and civilians Donnie Robichaud and Bobbie Lee Wright. They were killed the morning of Aug. 10, 2018, at an apartment building on Brookside Drive on Fredericton's north side.

What goes into a fitness assessment

Outside the courthouse, Woodside said he couldn't speak about the specifics of the Raymond case, but he could speak about fitness in general. He said he's been a forensic psychiatrist for more than 20 years and hasadministered thousands of fitness assessments.

A fitness assessment is "pretty straightforward," Woodside said.

"The typical questions would be,youknow, what've youbeen charged with? Do you know how you can plead in court?" he said. "We ask them about what the worst thing that could happen if you get convicted sometimes people would say 'Oh, Icould be beheaded, or I could be killed.'' That might be an indication that they don't understand Canadian law."

Other questions include who's in court, what are their jobs, and who makes decision about guilt or innocence in court?

He said most people can answer the questions"pretty easily."

"If you've seen any TV show involving the courtroom you'd have a pretty good idea about all those questions, so youhave to be quite unwell to be struggling with those types of questions."

Woodside also said that in general, it's rare for people to fakebeing unfitbecause there's no escaping the charges.

"It's rare in my experience in fitness hearings because there really is no gain," he said. "Your charges don't go away if you're found unfit. As soon as you're fit again you go back to court and you face your charges."

Near the end of the hearing, Fergusonlifted the publication ban on these facts from Thursday's proceedings:

• Woodside assessed Raymond three times, in November 2018, March 2019 and September 2019.
• Woodside spent 10 hours with Raymondoverall.
• Woodside's opinion Thursday was based on interactions he had with Raymond, recordings of what Raymond saidin court, and then some testimony about interactionsbetweenpeople connected with the case and Raymond.

Woodside's opinion about Raymond's fitness remains under publication ban.

'Incredibly important'

A jury of eight women and four men heardthe testimony at Raymond's fitness hearing.

Outside the Fredericton courthouse earlier this afternoon, Gorham said a fitness hearing is "incredibly important."

"[It] ensures that a person is able to participate in a meaningful and fair way," Gorham said.

He said he doesn't want to comment on the progress of the case because of the publication ban and out of respect for the jury.

The fitness hearing was called after Gorham made an application for it "by reason of a mental disorder." Based on Raymond's behaviour, and other evidence, Ferguson previously found reasonable grounds to choose a jury to decide if Raymond is fit to stand trial.

"I would sayparenthetically that this step is not going to delay the trial, it's not going to put the trial off, and it's not going to be a defence," Gorham said.

"All that this does is it allows, is to get Mr. Raymond treatment either in a voluntary or involuntarybasis, if there's a finding of unfitness. And then the trial can go ahead."

He said in the long run it could save money because it could reduce the chances of an appeal.

Ferguson has also said Raymond will stand trial for the criminal charges he's facing no matter what this jury decides about his fitness. It's just a matter of when, he said.

If Raymond is found unfit, he'll be prescribed a treatment order of 30 or 60 days, and reassessed for fitness after that.

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The question of fitness to stand trial addresses the accused's current mental state and not their state of mind during an alleged crime. It is distinct from criminal responsibility.

Defendants found fit to stand trial areconsideredcapable of understanding court proceedings and of defending themselves, either on their own or througha lawyer.